[claviska]

The power is out today after a small burst and, while I’m sure it will be back on soon, I figured it would be a good time to test the Lightning’s Pro Power Onboard to feed the 220V inlet on the house using the truck.

So I turned everything on our breaker off, put it into generator mode, turned on a few key things (fridge, lights, internet) and plugged the same cord I use for the generator into the Lightning. The truck’s screen immediately popped up an error saying “ground fault detected” and keeps shutting off the power.

Any electricians know what’s up with this? At first I figured I was overloading it, but I don’t think that’s the case given everything I have turned off. I also don’t believe it’s an actual ground fault occurring. Our backup generator has 9,375 starting watts and 7,500 running watts and we put a lot more load on that normally.

Note: I am NOT using the Charge Station Pro and this is NOT the home power feature you see Ford advertising. I’m sure there is logical reason for why this won’t work, but I’m curious to know what it is. (And it would be pretty sweet if it did work without the CSP.)

 

[claviska]

Meanwhile… 😂

 

[FM_Jack]

Your answer may be in this video. This is the hybrid, same system they used in Texas last year. I feel like I remember that ground fault issue you are mentioning but I don't recall it specifically:

 

[claviska]

Thanks! He mentions a ground loop, which makes sense since many of our breakers are arc/GFCI, but he doesn’t seem to mention how he works around it.

It would be nice to plug the house in, but I’m not sure what I need to do to work around it.

 

[Voltz]

Have you tried to turn all but one non-GFCI critical load breaker off to see if a single circuit works?

 

[claviska]

I have not, but I suppose that’s the next step. Fortunately, the power is back on. I’ll have to give that a try this week since it’s too close to the kid’s bed time to try it now.

 

[Leaf to Lightning : )]

the truck is built with a Bonded Neutral, which does not allow the truck to then provide power to a home, directly, due to the 'ground loop' issue. The only solution is to use a separate sub-panel/transfer switch that is designed to solve that, or to disconnect the ground wire from one end of your 'generator cord', which effectively does the same. Many generator owners with Bonded Neutral generators have always had to do the same, for temporary needs like this. While some will laud this as unsafe, some of us will take this route versus the expensive equipment otherwise required. Ford has not provided any real reason for a Bonded Neutral, but it is what it is until they change it or provide some other work-around.

 

[Voltz]

I have not, but I suppose that’s the next step.

Someone else posted this link that will put you on the road to understanding what's happening:

How to Avoid Tripping a Generator with a Bonded Neutral - Kyle's Garage

A GFI transfer switch eliminates your tripping generator problems. Read this article to find out how.

kylesgarage.com

 

[mattballew]

I have rend that you can disconnect the ground from your generator inlet. Not necessarily to code but apparently it works.

 

[704eer]

the truck is built with a Bonded Neutral, which does not allow the truck to then provide power to a home, directly, due to the 'ground loop' issue. The only solution is to use a separate sub-panel/transfer switch that is designed to solve that, or to disconnect the ground wire from one end of your 'generator cord', which effectively does the same. Many generator owners with Bonded Neutral generators have always had to do the same, for temporary needs like this. While some will laud this as unsafe, some of us will take this route versus the expensive equipment otherwise required. Ford has not provided any real reason for a Bonded Neutral, but it is what it is until they change it or provide some other work-around.

This is 100% accurate. Had a dedicated sub panel and inlet installed, we got the same Ground Fault error and this was the fix.

 

[123xyz]

the truck is built with a Bonded Neutral, which does not allow the truck to then provide power to a home, directly, due to the 'ground loop' issue. The only solution is to use a separate sub-panel/transfer switch that is designed to solve that, or to disconnect the ground wire from one end of your 'generator cord', which effectively does the same. Many generator owners with Bonded Neutral generators have always had to do the same, for temporary needs like this. While some will laud this as unsafe, some of us will take this route versus the expensive equipment otherwise required. Ford has not provided any real reason for a Bonded Neutral, but it is what it is until they change it or provide some other work-around.

I'm not an electrician, but I imagine the bonded neutral is because the truck has no true ground (there is no connection between the truck and the ground). Without a bonded neutral, there wouldn't be any ground at all. As for safety, connecting a generator that has no ground (your truck) to a panel connected to ground without connecting the generator's bonded "ground" conductor seems to have no safety disadvantage relative to connecting to a generator without a bonded ground and is certainly safer than disconnecting your home's true ground from your panel. I feel like I said that in an unnecessarily complicated way, but a "ground" that connects to the ground (dirt) has to be better than one connected to an ungrounded truck/generator.

 

[123xyz]

View attachment 3713
Meanwhile… 😂

A portable generator not connected to a grounding rod with a bonded neutral (the only way the ground conductor can connect to anything in a generator without a grounding rod) would have the exact same problem unless an electrician did one of the things suggested here as a workaround. The advantage would be that an electrician would have done it and would have done it in a safe and code-compliant way.

 

[KElkhorn]

Has anyone done something like this:

(Reliance TWB2003DR)

RelianceSitePortal

www.reliancecontrols.com

And then wired one of these at/near garage?

(Reliance PB30)

RelianceSitePortal

www.reliancecontrols.com

Looks like about $600 in hardware, would obviously need wire and install, but would allow you to back-feed your 200 Amp panel with your 30 amp gas/propane/NG generator, or from the pro power 240 plug on the truck. You could also potentially deal with your bonded neutral safely between the transfer switch and the receptacle

 

[Mujenpwr]

Good info thanks

 

[123xyz]

It's not fundamentally different from backfeeding from a portable generator. I'd want to at least pull a permit before doing that and probably hire an actual electrician. Power companies tend to be sensitive about people DIYing this because of the risk of electrocuting their workers if a transfer switch isn't properly installed.

 

[Wiseguy]

Today, I was able to power my home using my Ford Lightning SR for 2 hours to test the system. I lost 6 miles of range so I lost 1 mile of range per 20 minutes during my test. I have an existing 50amp Generator Inlet box with Generator Interlock kit on my main panel. I ordered a 50 to 30 amp adapter with additional 25’ 30 amp cord. I ended up breaking off the Ground pin on the adapter which was the cheapest item (cost $20) instead of rewiring anything inside my home to stay within code in the homes wiring. Once everything was hooked up I turned my main off and turned on the generator breaker and then powered on the Pro Onboard. I was able to run everything in the home including the Heat except for some large appliances like the dishwasher, washer/dryer. I also made a video, link below. Disclaimer: bypassing the Ground (though it’s still using the Ground of the main panel) is against code and attempt at your own risk.

Setup video- Lightning4life on TikTok

Part cost for anyone looking to do the same:

1. 30 amp Inlet generator box- $50 on Amazon
2. 6/3 cable - $4 per foot from Nassau Cable (cost depends on distance from main panel to location inlet box will be installed)
3. 2” PVC conduit (optional) at local HD/Lowe’s- if running 6/3 cable outside needing PVC conduit for the run to the inlet box.
4. 40 amp breaker $20 at local HD/Lowe’s- to leave some additional “cushion” to cover the 20% extra passed the 30amp output.
5. Generator Interlock Kit $25 on Amazon for safety to deter mistakenly backfeeding (this is very important!)
6. 25’ 14-30 cord on Amazon $60 to connection from Inlet box to Lightning

Note: I already had a 50amp box so I needed additional cables and adapters which I didn’t include.

You can do the full install for under $200 if the inlet box is close to the main panel like mine was in my garage and install it all yourself. In addition, an electrician may not want to be liable for bypassing the Ground on the cord.

 

[123xyz]

Today, I was able to power my home using my Ford Lightning SR for 2 hours to test the system. I lost 6 miles of range so I lost 1 mile of range per 20 minutes during my test. I have an existing 50amp Generator Inlet box with Generator Interlock kit on my main panel. I ordered a 50 to 30 amp adapter with additional 25’ 30 amp cord. I ended up breaking off the Ground pin on the adapter which was the cheapest item (cost $20) instead of rewiring anything inside my home to stay within code in the homes wiring. Once everything was hooked up I turned my main off and turned on the generator breaker and then powered on the Pro Onboard. I was able to run everything in the home including the Heat except for some large appliances like the dishwasher, washer/dryer. I also made a video, link below. Disclaimer: bypassing the Ground (though it’s still using the Ground of the main panel) is against code and attempt at your own risk.

Setup video- Lightning4life on TikTok

Part cost for anyone looking to do the same:

1. 30 amp Inlet generator box- $50 on Amazon
2. 6/3 cable - $4 per foot from Nassau Cable (cost depends on distance from main panel to location inlet box will be installed)
3. 2” PVC conduit (optional) at local HD/Lowe’s- if running 6/3 cable outside needing PVC conduit for the run to the inlet box.
4. 40 amp breaker $20 at local HD/Lowe’s- to leave some additional “cushion” to cover the 20% extra passed the 30amp output.
5. Generator Interlock Kit $25 on Amazon for safety to deter mistakenly backfeeding (this is very important!)
6. 25’ 14-30 cord on Amazon $60 to connection from Inlet box to Lightning

Note: I already had a 50amp box so I needed additional cables and adapters which I didn’t include.

You can do the full install for under $200 if the inlet box is close to the main panel like mine was in my garage and install it all yourself. In addition, an electrician may not want to be liable for bypassing the Ground on the cord.

Sounds great. Am I right that you're using the 240v socket that comes with 9.6kW Pro Power Onboard, which provides up to 7.2 kW (30A) though the 240V receptacle added with the 9.6kW option and 2.4 kW through the receptacles that are included in the base model?

Also, are you sure that it's a code violation to not connect the ground conductor from a grounded buliding panel to an ungrounded portable generator (your truck being the ungrounded portable generator in this setup)? It doesn't seem to reduce safety in the building at all (its system already has the right number of grounds). It does miss the chance to provide a ground to the portable generator/truck, but that's already approved for use without a ground.

 

[Wiseguy]

Sounds great. Am I right that you're using the 240v socket that comes with 9.6kW Pro Power Onboard, which provides up to 7.2 kW (30A) though the 240V receptacle added with the 9.6kW option and 2.4 kW through the receptacles that are included in the base model?

Also, are you sure that it's a code violation to not connect the ground conductor from a grounded buliding panel to an ungrounded portable generator (your truck being the ungrounded portable generator in this setup)? It doesn't seem to reduce safety in the building at all (its system already has the right number of grounds). It does miss the chance to provide a ground to the portable generator/truck, but that's already approved for use without a ground.

Yep you’re correct, the 240 in the bed uses up to 7.2kw (240vx30amps). It’s neat because it’s breaks it out between the two 120 Lines (A & B) at 3.6kw each totaling 7.2kw. Also, I’ve heard from a few electricians it’s against code, but I don’t have the exact code on hand. It uses the Ground of the home instead of both the Truck and Home which causes the Ground fault so the risk seems minimal since it’s still Grounded. I think the reasoning they were stating was altering an electrical device outside its normal means of use.