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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
I mean , I guess the production quantity is supposed to go to 80,000. Do they continue this opaque bullshit wave system with no clarity or rhyme or reason where we call the dealer who tells us to call ford who tells us to call the dealer who tells us to call ford who. . .
Do they continue the prioritization system, letting the dealership play king maker at the expense of the loyal customer who paid their dues to commit with $$ day one to their r&d project?
do they release more orders day one?
I ordered a model y performance online in November, took delivery last sunday. Still completely supply constrained product. There was no dog shit hidden dealer games, just “your car will be ready soon, and Then, co
e in Sunday”, and then 3 minutes of paper work to complete a deal with an agreed upon price, and I was on the road.
Night and day.
Ford wants to beat Tesla, it’s more than sheet metals rubber and batteries. They need to overhaul their customer experience, cuz this sucks.
Elon came into Ford’s kitchen 10 years ago, went through their fridge, and made a ham sandwich. He’s still sitting at their dining room table asking for a refill.
 

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Farley is well aware that the dealer network he inherited is a ball & chain. There is only so much he can do about it.

For our part, we as voters need to be paying attention to politicians that keep pushing legislation aimed at artificially propping up the dealer-only system. My wife ordered our Y on a whim, using her phone on a lunch break. A few weeks later it was in our driveway. It was the easiest car buying experience we have ever had.
 

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Elon came into Car Industry’s kitchen 10 years ago, went through their fridge, and made a ham sandwich. He’s still sitting at their dining room table asking for a refill.
I would say he's still pushing as much as he can. Didn't OK just pass something that may make him close up stores in the state and force those to drive out of state to get a Tesla? Though maybe with the home delivery that isn't that bad, IF the bill doesn't interfere with that as well.

Be cute if Ford and whoever sets up a system that makes your "new" car purchase a used car service by putting the title through a round of ownership. Though titles are a state thing so...."shrugs"

This frustration with a manufacturer isn't fair when it is the states that are the problem. Elon has been fighting states since the beginning. And I think he's only made progress because of the money they have been able to make/generate. Instead of Ford v Tesla, it is Ford/Tesla v states. Tesla only had so much power and deep pockets, Ford Chevy etc do. Ford making threats can have more of an effect than Tesla. Which is why it gets frustracting when Elon says something stupid or does something unnecessary, and doesn't keep people on his side. Really need to stop letting people watch movies while the car is in drive.
 

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Farley is well aware that the dealer network he inherited is a ball & chain. There is only so much he can do about it.

For our part, we as voters need to be paying attention to politicians that keep pushing legislation aimed at artificially propping up the dealer-only system. My wife ordered our Y on a whim, using her phone on a lunch break. A few weeks later it was in our driveway. It was the easiest car buying experience we have ever had.
getting tesla service is easy if you live in a larger metro area where they actually have service available. but most people don't live anywhere near one. the closest one to me is 3 hours away.
 

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Discussion Starter · #5 ·
I would say he's still pushing as much as he can. Didn't OK just pass something that may make him close up stores in the state and force those to drive out of state to get a Tesla? Though maybe with the home delivery that isn't that bad, IF the bill doesn't interfere with that as well.

Be cute if Ford and whoever sets up a system that makes your "new" car purchase a used car service by putting the title through a round of ownership. Though titles are a state thing so...."shrugs"

This frustration with a manufacturer isn't fair when it is the states that are the problem. Elon has been fighting states since the beginning. And I think he's only made progress because of the money they have been able to make/generate. Instead of Ford v Tesla, it is Ford/Tesla v states. Tesla only had so much power and deep pockets, Ford Chevy etc do. Ford making threats can have more of an effect than Tesla. Which is why it gets frustracting when Elon says something stupid or does something unnecessary, and doesn't keep people on his side. Really need to stop letting people watch movies while the car is in drive.
I frustrated with this experience and how vague it has been. I get that I didn’t get to order one due to supply and extreme demand. The process was mucky and difficult to understand. And there was no clear point of communication. I spent a ton of time calling a bunch of sources getting nowhere. My dealer didn’t really provide any value to this system yet they were in the middle of the communication loop somehow. It no one took any ownership of being an honest point of contact.
it definitely created intrigue and hype and anxiety. But I wasted many days trying tounderstand the process and if I was going to be a part of it. It was a bunch of needlessly wasted time.
Ford brags about their abity to sell cars and ramp up production and be the big boy in this industry, but their handling of this was anything but. The Tesla buying experience is in a totally different class. Having dealt with both over the past few months in the same market. and it is ALL communication. ALL of it. If I needed a question about Tesla, I just responded to a text chain they opened when we went live. Ford could have done that. They didn’t, they pushed me to dealers who didn’t respond at all. That has nothing to do with state law.
i dunno. They have some work to do.
 

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getting tesla service is easy if you live in a larger metro area where they actually have service available. but most people don't live anywhere near one. the closest one to me is 3 hours away.
I live a long way from any Tesla store in Southern Oregon. It is about 4hrs to Portland, the closest Tesla store. I did drive my trade to Portland last year to get our new car, but have not needed to go back since. I have only needed tires for the car since (@ over 47k miles now), which I bought locally.

My brother, on the other hand, had a few issues with his S. Tesla sent a tech to his driveway to fix it. Easiest process imaginable. So, living in a very rural area (I live off-grid), Tesla service is still easy.
😁
 

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All this complaining about Ford being vague and yet I bet most people waiting on a Lightning also have a reservation on a Cybertruck. Nothing in this world has been more vague than whether or not anyone will ever see a Cybertruck in their driveway in the next ten years, let alone ever see it even come to fruition.
Our first-world problems need to be put in proper perspective. Sure… I would’ve liked to see a Lightning in my driveway this year but waiting another year, or even two, won’t kill me.
 

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Agreed. I don't think Ford is being vague at all. They are saying that they accepted your reservation, are ramping up volume as quickly as they can, and they will build your truck as soon as they can.

Sure, you have to deal with fickle dealers, but in reality, also not that much of an issue. Do some leg work, find a good dealer, and stick with them. Reward them for their business practices, and deny the crooked ones your business.

Also a really good point, first world problems. I am an incredibly fortunate person that these are my problems, and not some of the problems that we see going on around the world at this point. I have driven electric for a long time, currently drive 100% electric, and my next truck will operate without a drop of blood oil being burned. I am enormously thankful for U.S. automakers that are stepping up and making this possible.
 

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Agreed. I don't think Ford is being vague at all. They are saying that they accepted your reservation, are ramping up volume as quickly as they can, and they will build your truck as soon as they can.

Sure, you have to deal with fickle dealers, but in reality, also not that much of an issue. Do some leg work, find a good dealer, and stick with them. Reward them for their business practices, and deny the crooked ones your business.

Also a really good point, first world problems. I am an incredibly fortunate person that these are my problems, and not some of the problems that we see going on around the world at this point. I have driven electric for a long time, currently drive 100% electric, and my next truck will operate without a drop of blood oil being burned. I am enormously thankful for U.S. automakers that are stepping up and making this possible.
And as production ramps up I think the power shifts to the buyer. A lot of dealership roulette going on this year to try to game a spot. But moving forward I think it will be less about specific allocations or EV states and more just getting a truck to every reservation who wants one. Find a good dealer and let the dealers trying to bend you over sit this one out.
 

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I try not to turn to much of what I reply with into Tesla bashing but yea, making it seem like Ford isn't getting stuff done isn't fair. Or conflating what happens to you with a dealership as Ford. And accepting that Tesla has been able to skirt having to go through dealerships. Which imo is the lucky on their part, it isn't some innovation that they thought of.

I have a CT reservation, before my lightning reservation and now I have a Lightning order and no word whatsoever from Tesla on the CT. I think if I put in an order for a Rivian right now I'd get that before the CT. But next year is next year. Tesla made a misstep redesigning it. It will cost more now and I have no idea why Elon said making an afford truck is impossible or why they think they are the only ones that can stream line the factory process.

An even simpiler example, you want to say that Tesla has been doing this for 10 years and know what they are doing? Ford's been building for over a 100 years, shouldn't they be given a wee bit more credit? It isn't even a year after putting in the reservation that people are able able to order it. I don't even feel like Ford has been bragging about how many reservations they got but more on how many they are going to be able to deliver; since that holds more value.
 

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Agreed. I don't think Ford is being vague at all. They are saying that they accepted your reservation, are ramping up volume as quickly as they can, and they will build your truck as soon as they can.

Sure, you have to deal with fickle dealers, but in reality, also not that much of an issue. Do some leg work, find a good dealer, and stick with them. Reward them for their business practices, and deny the crooked ones your business.

Also a really good point, first world problems. I am an incredibly fortunate person that these are my problems, and not some of the problems that we see going on around the world at this point. I have driven electric for a long time, currently drive 100% electric, and my next truck will operate without a drop of blood oil being burned. I am enormously thankful for U.S. automakers that are stepping up and making this possible.
Ford’s big sin was allowing dealers to prioritize. My dealer prioritized his staffs orders and no one else. And those sales guys have every intention of flipping the trucks to make $10k+.
 

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Ford’s big sin was allowing dealers to prioritize. My dealer prioritized his staffs orders and no one else. And those sales guys have every intention of flipping the trucks to make $10k+.
And that's why Ford put in a clause so you can't sell it for at least a year?

Which how does that benefit the dealership?
 

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Well, that should be a pretty easy decision not to do business with that dealer then!
It doesn’t change the fact that lots of us reserved early and Ford screwed up by allowing dealers to prioritize outside of the reservation order. That decision is the number 1 reason the process has been opaque and feels unfair to so many people.
 

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2021 Mustang Mach E First Edition, 2016 Nissan Leaf, 2003 Toyota Tacoma, F-150 Lightning reserved
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Ford’s big sin was allowing dealers to prioritize. My dealer prioritized his staffs orders and no one else. And those sales guys have every intention of flipping the trucks to make $10k+.
Ford got a lot of flack from dealers when dealers had no control over the Mustang Mach E orders and priorities. Allowing dealers to prioritize a limited number of orders seemed like a reasonable compromise but the way dealers handled it made customers feel abused. Hopefully dealers don’t get another chance to prioritize going into MY2023 and Ford shifts back to a customer-focused approach, especially with those dealers who are screwing customers with pay for priority and other ADMs. I’m hoping Ford cuts allocations to unscrupulous dealers as they have threatened.
 

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Ford doesn’t put in the no-resale clause. They said they would support dealerships that chose to add that clause to a sales contract. It’s entirely at the dealers discretion.
How does letting their salesman buy the vehicle benefit the dealer? If the point of them doing it is to flip it for a higher value?
 

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How does letting their salesman buy the vehicle benefit the dealer? If the point of them doing it is to flip it for a higher value?
Well, it’s a basically zero-cost perk the dealer can give its sales staff. I also wouldn’t be surprised to find out that one or two of those trucks are actually the GMs orders and that they’ll refuse delivery so that the truck reverts to dealer stock and will be sold at $10-30k mark up. Heck, if I was the GM I might offer to split the markup with any of my staff that cancel their order.
 

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If Ford can penalize dealers with excessive ADM charged by withholding orders and not sending product to them does this not also punish the customer? Would Ford be able, within its franchise agreements, to not ship inventory to a particular dealer AND, notify customers with reservations at that dealer of this penalty. Bit shipping cars to dealer xyz, not only sucks for xyz, but also for customers of xyz. If the customers can be notified that dealer abc is a Ford approved "A+dealer" that isn't taking extra advantage of customers and that by moving your order to abc you will get your vehicle sooner. This is a mess that could get messier.
 

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If Ford can penalize dealers with excessive ADM charged by withholding orders and not sending product to them does this not also punish the customer?
I think they would only start this phase after the campaign to sell the first 15-20k is completed this year the remaining reservation might be handled a little differently.

In the recent MOCO Survey I suggested they provide a selection of regional dealers with programmed ADM's pick one out of a list of 10, allowing the customer to revise their selections, the order routes to that dealer with allocation dynamically shifted to the most competitive dealer.

I also suggested, that dealers feigning ignorance about programming their ADM value be held foot to fire for the 0.00 value.
 
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