[Maxable]

After a long wait, my lightning is finally here at the local dealership! They need a few days to do the PDI.

In the mean time, I'm mentally preparing for the negotiations. I highly doubt they will budge from MSRP as I'll have to work on the trade in.

My question is, does anyone know how much a dealership is making off a MSRP lightning sale? Just thought it would be good information to have in my back pocket.


Thanks!

 

[Henry Ford]

Look up episode 512 of This American Life. It's called '129 Cars' and explains how dealerships work better than anything else I've come across. As a bonus it's really entertaining.

The gist of it is one vehicle sale doesn't really tell the whole story. There are manufacturer incentives that make the profit or loss on any individual sale nebulous.

That said, basic supply and demand is probably the biggest driver of price on any new car right now. To me MSRP seems about right. I wouldn't pay more but I also wouldn't expect a dealer to accept less.

In my opinion, it's probably worth looking into selling your trade-in private party if you want to maximize value. It's additional work but if you are willing to detail your vehicle, take a lot of photos, and market it well it will be worth your time.

I recently sold my old truck for more than double what the dealer offered and at the top of KBB value. That's probably an extreme case because it was a low mileage 12 year old truck in unusually good shape but I think you're better off selling private party a large majority of the time.

 

[GDN]

The referenced article is the best we have, but roughly the dealer is or can make up to about 10%, if they don't, that is on them for not playing by the rules, so it's on them and not you.

You should have other valuations for your trade from CarMax, etc and know your situation and what your limits are.

 

[selahallan]

After a long wait, my lightning is finally here at the local dealership! They need a few days to do the PDI.

In the mean time, I'm mentally preparing for the negotiations. I highly doubt they will budge from MSRP as I'll have to work on the trade in.

My question is, does anyone know how much a dealership is making off a MSRP lightning sale? Just thought it would be good information to have in my back pocket.


Thanks!

We didn't have a tradein but when we showed up to get our lightning they jacked up the price $4300...we should our order paperwork and they pretty much said we didn't get price protection and that if we didn't want our lightning they could sell it for $10k more the next day. It was not a very good Ford customer experience but we do love the truck. Now if we could only get the charger...been calling every day for 1.5 week and it is like the keystone cops... no date when the charger will ship. Second bad customer experience.

 

[Pja3668]

@Selahallen that sucks. I hope I don’t encounter that in a month or so when mine delivers. And hope other people don’t experience that either. I think some dealers see the writing on the wall. With Ford Model E and EVs becoming more popular that means less servicing and less direct sales interactions.

 

[shocker]

I read that under Ford's pricing model for EVs, invoice = MSRP,. But for the Lightning, Ford sends the dealer 4.8% of the MSRP as a profit margin. Whether a dealer would be willing to give up any of that in negotiation... I would try certainly, but also plan on the answer being no,

 

[ChasingCoral]

We didn't have a tradein but when we showed up to get our lightning they jacked up the price $4300...we should our order paperwork and they pretty much said we didn't get price protection and that if we didn't want our lightning they could sell it for $10k more the next day. It was not a very good Ford customer experience but we do love the truck. Now if we could only get the charger...been calling every day for 1.5 week and it is like the keystone cops... no date when the charger will ship. Second bad customer experience.

The Ford Charge Station Pro comes a few weeks after delivery. Have you received the email from SunRun asking to confirm your address?

 

[Maxable]

Thanks so much for the info! I'll check it out

 

[larry.thompson]

Curious about dealer fees, Tex, tag, title…and any other add on’s they typically pad the invoice with. Are these negotiable? My dealer said they will honor MSRP price, but do I expect to pay a few grand above that to drive off the lot?

 

[Voltz]

Tex, tag, title…and any other add on’s they typically pad the invoice with. Are these negotiable?

In my experience, those fees are only negotiable as reductions in MSRP. Even dealers who are willing to negotiate a deal on the sale show the fees as the same amounts on the final sale. I've had more than one sales/F&I guy tell me that's the law. In may just be in my state or it may be just another 'dealer said' fabrication.

Specific to the Lightning, it's such a high demand vehicle that it was MSRP plus their extortionary BS paperwork fee plus all taxes, etc. for me. Imagine going into a grocery and being charged fees to ring up the groceries and prepare a receipt.

 

[Berm]

Tax, registration, and title should all be standard fees everyone has to pay (dealer not having room to wiggle).

(*in Michigan but pretty sure most places) There is an “up to $25” charge for plate fees they can tack on to provide you a plate then and there. The program to do so costs the dealer much less than $25 but they are allowed to charge up to $25 to do so. If you want to avoid that you can go to your DMV or SOS and get your plate yourself to avoid that upcharge and ironically enough the dealer will have to do more paperwork likely to change things around without being able to charge you.

Dealer fees, setup fees, and documents fees are definitely a dealer padded item. In some states or for AXZ plan buyers for example those fees are capped around $75. I’d say if your doc fee is >$75 then the dealer is just trying to squeeze a couple extra $ out of you (and everyone else).

 

[larry.thompson]

Looking at my dealers website (located in Florda), they have:

$495 Electronic registration filing fee
$45 private tag agency fee
$899 pre delivery service fee
$787 dealer handling fee

This adds about $2,226 to the MSRP, plus the 6% sales tax. So for a $88k Lariat, I'm looking at around $95,500 to drive off the lot.
Dealer has promised to honor the MSRP price, do you think its worth haggling over the extra fees above, or just pay it and go?

 

[rdr854]

Looking at my dealers website (located in Florda), they have:

$495 Electronic registration filing fee
$45 private tag agency fee
$899 pre delivery service fee
$787 dealer handling fee

This adds about $2,226 to the MSRP, plus the 6% sales tax. So for a $88k Lariat, I'm looking at around $95,500 to drive off the lot.
Dealer has promised to honor the MSRP price, do you think its worth haggling over the extra fees above, or just pay it and go?

The pre delivery fee is absurd since the dealer is already paid by Ford to PDI the vehicle. The handling fee is likewise a dealer fee that could be negotiable in coming up with an out the door price. The other two fees seem legit - especially if they are pass thrus and not marked up.

 

[Voltz]

The pre delivery fee is absurd since the dealer is already paid by Ford to PDI the vehicle.

Exactly. Sounds more like a euphemism for ADM. I wonder if the manufacturer has a policy on such a fee? I guess they'd say that there a difference between pre-delivery inspection and pre-delivery service?

 

[selahallan]

The Ford Charge Station Pro comes a few weeks after delivery. Have you received the email from SunRun asking to confirm your address?

It is now Day 15 since we received our Ford Lightning Lariat with extended battery. I have called Sunrun 13 times...nothing nobody can tell me when it will ship or when I will get it. The same thing happens every morning I call... let me verify your address ok you will get an email in 24 hours... this is repeated daily. I have written into FORD support and they say they can't help me because it is on SunRun. We live in a small town with no DC Fast charger so definitely need our charger. So far, not a good experience at all.

 

[ChasingCoral]

It is now Day 15 since we received our Ford Lightning Lariat with extended battery. I have called Sunrun 13 times...nothing nobody can tell me when it will ship or when I will get it. The same thing happens every morning I call... let me verify your address ok you will get an email in 24 hours... this is repeated daily. I have written into FORD support and they say they can't help me because it is on SunRun. We live in a small town with no DC Fast charger so definitely need our charger. So far, not a good experience at all.

Make sure the dealer has listed it as sold in their system. If not, SunRun doesn’t get the signal to ship the FCSP.

 

[selahallan]

Make sure the dealer has listed it as sold in their system. If not, SunRun doesn’t get the signal to ship the FCSP.

Yes Deal says it shows as sold. When we call Sunrun and give them the VIN they see it and we confirm our shipping address but nothing happens.

 

[larry.thompson]

The pre delivery fee is absurd since the dealer is already paid by Ford to PDI the vehicle. The handling fee is likewise a dealer fee that could be negotiable in coming up with an out the door price. The other two fees seem legit - especially if they are pass thrus and not marked up.

Appreciate the feedback. I researched the electronic filing fee and it seems to run about $225 in Florida, so that is marked up too.
I know the auto market is expected to go down this year, but I definitely feel at a disadvantage because the dealer is probably hoping you don't take the truck, so they can put it in inventory and mark it up $10k. I know that was the case last year, not sure if it still holds true. I guess you have to pick your battles.
I will try to get the "pre-delivery service fee" taken off but won't argue the others. All dealers seem to charge a handling fee for paperwork and other expenses, so if I can get one of those two expenses removed, I think its par for the course.

 

[larry.thompson]

Yes Deal says it shows as sold. When we call Sunrun and give them the VIN they see it and we confirm our shipping address but nothing happens.

I read a few posts from owners saying the charge station just showed up in the mail with no notice. Sunrun seems overwhelmed by Ford customers, I don't think they are very organized. Worst case scenario, maybe ask your dealer to loan you a portable charger until it arrives?
Please keep us posted on your progress. My truck is supposed to arrive at the dealer next week. I already reached out to Sunrun to see if they would send me the charger in advance so i could install before the truck arrived, but that was a solid no. I'm really hoping it shows up quickly.

 

[Henry Ford]

It is now Day 15 since we received our Ford Lightning Lariat with extended battery. I have called Sunrun 13 times...nothing nobody can tell me when it will ship or when I will get it. The same thing happens every morning I call... let me verify your address ok you will get an email in 24 hours... this is repeated daily. I have written into FORD support and they say they can't help me because it is on SunRun. We live in a small town with no DC Fast charger so definitely need our charger. So far, not a good experience at all.

Call 866-631-3788 and dial extension 79750. If someone picks up it will be Elisa, if not select option 2 to speak with a Ford BEV specialist. They will be able to setup a case number for you.

The short story is there was a glitch in getting the required information from Ford to Sunrun. The affected VINs are known but I haven't been able to verify that my truck is actually on the list. I do have a case number and was told the charger should be sent out within a week, so fingers crossed. I actually received an email from Sunrun today and for the first time they actually acknowledged they understand what is going on.

The longer story is I bought my truck on December 12 and started calling about this on December 15. Sunrun is clueless and Ford - with the exception of the BEV specialists - are somewhere between useless and openly hostile. I ended up buying an extra Ford Charge Station Pro from someone who didn't need it because I lost hope that this will end quickly and my use-case for an EV falls apart if I can't charge at home. The truck became much more enjoyable once I had a charger installed.